Flotation Foam

fuseitinthesun · Post by **fuseitinthesun** » Wed Aug 18, 2010 8:46 am

I was lucky enough to go sailing every day for the last three days in really exciting wind for my little LS-13, 12-20mph. On Sunday I capsized for the first time ever, which was really fun, but also sort of inconvenient. We swam around to the bilgeboards and stood on them, righting the boat, but because of the way the boat floated while capsized (only the bow was out of the water), when turned upright she was so full of water that the stern was still underwater. It was impossible to bail the boat without being towed to shore and pulled up on the trailer. This makes me want to add more flotation foam to the back of the boat, currently I think only the bow has any, and the 4 life jackets stowed up there also probably added buoyancy.

Do you guys have an opinion on the best/most cost-effective product? Any application tips?

LeatherneckPA · Post by **LeatherneckPA** » Wed Aug 18, 2010 9:22 am

I will be interested to hear this because as far as I can see there is NO flotation in my LS-16 at all. I think it would be a really positive step to add some and I have tons of space to do it in.

It's going to have to be easily formed and able to deal with the heat of sitting in the sun all the time. I'm going to want to secure it in place, yet not interfere with scuppers and drainage. And of course it should be affordable.

And just how much flotation do you get per cubic foot? An LS-16 displaces 450 lbs and is rated to carry 900 lbs. So I'm guessing that I want about 750 to 900 lbs of floating ability?

Mario G · Post by **Mario G** » Wed Aug 18, 2010 9:50 am

http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?pat ... id=1368057

This should be what you are looking for

Jmckamey · Post by **Jmckamey** » Wed Aug 18, 2010 9:51 am

How about turning the boat upside down and spraying "Great Stuff" expandable insulating foam at $6.00 per can? I have to access the stern on my C22 and will have to remove some of the flotation, I thought I might experiment with that stuff. We used it to make a volcano for our daughters science project a few years ago. It sets up very well. Jeff

kokezaru · Post by **kokezaru** » Wed Aug 18, 2010 10:41 am

Jmckamey wrote: "Great Stuff" expandable insulating foam . . . We used it to make a volcano for our daughters science project a few years ago. It sets up very well. Jeff

Gee, I thought the "Volcano science project" was only done on TV and in the movies !!

Anyway, what about recycled materials? I have been seeing the use of empty plastic water bottles for flotation a lot recently. A group of sailboat racers filled a net full, and used it as a rounding mark. Also, someone built a whole boat out of two liter bottles and sailed it to Australia!

I don't know what the space is on an LS-13, it was just a thought, but its cheap, and will last forever.

Jmckamey · Post by **Jmckamey** » Wed Aug 18, 2010 11:06 am

Yea!! I like the bottle Idea. Some 2 liter bottles would work great. Could even glue them in place too.

fuseitinthesun · Post by **fuseitinthesun** » Wed Aug 18, 2010 1:05 pm

I'm reading on forums that 'Great Stuff' foam is a bad and un-economical idea. Mario, thanks for the link but this stuff ( http://www.uscomposites.com/foam.html ) looks like a better buy... thoughts? My idea going forward is to use plastic bottles, sealed into place using this poured-in foam. So, most of your air space comes from recycled materials, and you have to buy less foam. Is there any reason not to completely fill the space under the seats in an LS-13 with this stuff?

Banshi · Post by **Banshi** » Wed Aug 18, 2010 1:32 pm

My Sunfish uses rigid foam through out usually glued into place with something similar to foam-o seal you use to seal windows.

sauerleigh · Post by **sauerleigh** » Wed Aug 18, 2010 2:58 pm

I've purchased a variety of items from this company and they have all worked well. I have used the very heavy foam in hobby applications.
http://www.shopmaninc.com/foam.html

LeatherneckPA · Post by **LeatherneckPA** » Wed Aug 18, 2010 5:06 pm

fuseitinthesun wrote: this stuff ( http://www.uscomposites.com/foam.html ) looks like a better buy... thoughts? My idea going forward is to use plastic bottles, sealed into place using this poured-in foam. So, most of your air space comes from recycled materials, and you have to buy less foam. Is there any reason not to completely fill the space under the seats in an LS-13 with this stuff?

I really like the way you are thinking on this one. Plastic bottles, encapsulated in this stuff should last longer than the boat. I can't see any reason not to completely fill the space under my seats on the LS-16. I wanted to put a reinforcing plywood under there anyway since I am somewhat larger and heavier than the average sailor. And according to the add for that foam it can be done in layers. So you could put in your first set of bottles, foam over them, put in another layer, foam over them, repeat as needed until the space is full.

Paul · Post by **Paul** » Wed Aug 18, 2010 9:30 pm

Home Depot sells a blue flotation billet used for docks & platforms. Comes in different size extrusions and can be cut easily with a pull saw or hot wire saw. You have to ask for it at the special order desk. I found out about it because we used it to make cores for full scale airplane wings. It also glasses very well with vinylester resin.

mikepaddle · Post by **mikepaddle** » Thu Aug 19, 2010 6:17 am

Your best bet is to forget the bottles and "Great Stuff" type products. There are numerous suppliers online who sell the two part closed cell foam. Just do a little shopping for the best price. This is the same material that was used in 1960 under the plywood floor of my LS-16 and is still used today. Beware..."Great Stuff" type products are NOT closed cell and will soak up water.

It would be best to turn your boat over and pour it into the hollow seat area around the cockpit and down towards the floor. This stuff is amazing. Just mix the part A and part B liquids, pour, and watch it swell! You will most likely need the gallon containers at the minimum. The poured foam can be trimmed or finished out with a hacksaw blade.

LeatherneckPA · Post by **LeatherneckPA** » Thu Aug 19, 2010 2:10 pm

I was thinking more like lay it on it's side and fill everything from the deck to the front of the seat and from the ends of the tracks back, leaving just a little well back by the transom for a cooler or battery for the trolling motor.

fuseitinthesun · Post by **fuseitinthesun** » Thu Aug 19, 2010 2:49 pm

Iron Mike, that's what I was thinking as well. It would just make future modification of anything along the sides of the deck a real pain... I might start at the back corners and do capsize tests, adding layers further forward until it was sufficiently buoyant. That way I could leave the area under where the side shrouds attach open.

Banshi · Post by **Banshi** » Thu Aug 19, 2010 2:54 pm

watch it swell!

Make note of the "swell" part as in don't use in a space where it has little room to expand, short of separating things meant to be attached to one another.